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  lundi 14 2020 décembre
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Hello everybody

Can someone give me an idea for the price of a complete (architectural) template, adapted to the structure where I work? (I mean by that, how much would it cost me to have this template made by an external service provider).

I ask the question because I am getting into the subject outside of my working time (no moral debate please!), And I would like to be able to estimate the price of this work.

This template will include:
- Set of current system families (to start the project)
- Set of labels in phases
- All cartridges in phases
- Set of current nomenclatures
- Etc.
over a month ago
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#15726
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Good evening François,

Whatever your design tool (to be specified), a working template is always an asset. Depending on the design tool, the time spent on this task can vary greatly.
Anyway, it is a task that never comes down to a one-off service but rather to a work model that evolves with time and experience. Doing it yourself is undoubtedly the best way to obtain an effective template.
Better to have an incomplete template but evolving regularly rather than a template with small onions that it will take months to understand. The template sellers will fall on me :p .
With Archicad it takes me half a day for a well-structured agency with an existing charter. The advantage is that the creation of a family is not required with Archicad since the objects are as easily configurable as they are customizable and do not concern the design primitives (slab, wall, beam, column, etc.)
With Vectorworks and Allplan the subject will be just as easy to process, but I don't know how to process a template via Tekla.
over a month ago
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#15733
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Hello,

I am going in the direction of Christophe Fortineau, the time spent and the conditions of realization of an agency template are so variable, that without more information, it is impossible to predict the cost of the service.
We will all the same try to refine this observation.

NOTE: from there, I consider that you are talking about a template REVIT, given the terms you use.

For example, a Structure jig whose goal is the one and only modeling, in phases ESQ to PRO, of concrete elements cast in place, for relatively basic structures such as traditional collective housing, will perhaps only take a few days at a time. more, where a Fluids template (CVC + PBS + ELE) which must cover all of all the information of all model objects, with precise 3D modeling, meet a specific graphic charter, for all types of structures , from single-family homes to industrial sites, will take months of work.

So, above all, to estimate this time / cost, it is necessary to fully master the specifications of said template. You must master the challenges of your models, the reasons for creating a graphic charter, the work methodology, etc. :
- Types of projects targeted? Complexity of projects (I'm not talking about size, which is too often confused with complexity, but of a truly complex)?
- Nature of the families to be created? Proportion of use by each family? If you need to create a family of windows that covers a wide range of old buildings (very old, twisted, etc.) but you do this type of work once a year, don't bother with it at the start. . If, on the contrary, you make them your spearhead, these families must exist as soon as possible. While taking into account the great complexity and the long time it takes to make such families.
- Set of properties that it is possible to want to extract in a nomenclature or display in a label? This defines the list of shared parameters to be created.
- Types of lines? Graphic charter (= color and aspect of objects according to views)?
- Organization of the tree structure?
- Work methods ? Collaboration in Revit? Working with sub-projects? How to name the sub-projects? modeling rules?
- In general, rule for naming and tidying up shared parameter files, families, model files?

Once you have gone through, with your team, the contents of the template and defined your working methods, you must prioritize each parameter / family / etc. in order of importance according to:
- the number of times the / family / etc. is used daily (= regularity of use on several models)
- time spent creating each parameter / family / etc.
- the typology / complexity of the first projects that will be carried out with this template
- the desired internal working methods (how the models are exchanged, if necessary, tree structure of files on the server / NAS, etc., common modeling rules, etc.)

The list of points to at least think about at the start is still long. So, I come back to the importance of defining the specifications.
And you can see, in fact, that to speak of a "complete architectural template" does not really make sense. If, in a certain way, the BE Fluids sometimes work with the same base resulting from Fisa, from Stabicad ( Trimble MEP) or Magicad, which are plugins of Revit providing templates, family libraries and complementary functionalities, in architecture it is another pair of pretzels. Each agency has its own vision of a project, its own "paw", its working method, its internal wishes etc. In addition, just for walls, there can be two schools in modeling (multilayers or separate objects). For doors, windows and stairs, which are elements with complex geometries and tailor-made, with many and very varied accessories, the creation of families becomes incredibly more time-consuming and difficult.

For information, over the past 5 years I have listed here and there the needs and wishes of my architectural clients to design a unique Revit template, or, in any case, a set of templates, codified in the same way, which respond to different types of projects. I came to the conclusion that it would take me about 1 year to create all these templates / libraries of families / parameters and that, to be almost profitable and given the number of agencies received in training, each template would cost an average of € 2500. But the price depends on the number of copies sold. If you ask a service provider for a complete tailor-made template, adapted to your agency, and this service provider cannot do anything with this template subsequently, then the price will be totally induced by the time spent for you ( from 1 to 4 months, on average, based on my observations over the last few years).

The time / cost would be less on Archicad / Allplan / Vectorworks, because we can do without a good part of the complex families that are the doors and the windows, as well as a set of other parametric objects supplied by default with the software. .
Basically, Archicad supplies "ready-mixed" concrete, where Revit independently supplies the sand, gravel, water and admixtures that we have to dose ourselves according to the desired result.
In the first case, you don't know how it works, but it works. And the day it doesn't work anymore, you are in a bit of a hassle and you have to learn how to make concrete. In a second case, you must already know how to make concrete, so you fully understand what to do and how to adapt it, but it takes longer.

Funny Notes:
Archicad requires learning GDL, a programming language, when you want to create your own parametric object. Tekla can also be very heavy in development, if the user wants to create his own dynamic components and / or his own drawing templates, included in a prototype. It easily involves HTML, Python, C, other programming languages. Do "real" programming to use drawing software ...
over a month ago
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#15734
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Hello and nice answer François,

I still learned a lot here from reading you. On the other hand, it is absolutely not useful to have the slightest knowledge of GDL for the preparation of an Archicad template as you describe it. Native objects are extremely parametric and their customization does not require any code. The tool bends to the needs of a novice but nevertheless leaves the field open to enthusiasts. This idea was received tenaciously but NO GDL is absolutely not required.
Also it would be very appreciable to read your feedback on your work to prepare your template @ François Pendelio.
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